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Closed 11 years ago.
I have a project need to start in a week; Joomla and Drupal are both in my candidates list. Performance is the key to my project: Which one do you think is better for me?
Drupal is better supported for high load sites than Joomla. It is also much more flexible. I've built sites on both and I wouldn't touch Joomla again tbh. Companies like Turner Media run sites like "Cartoon Network" on Drupal, albeit highly customised and thoroughly beefed up.
If you're using Drupal 7 it has a lot of these customisations built into the core and so will absolutely fly along on all but the biggest projects.
Check out the Drupal High Performance Group if you have any specific questions.
http://groups.drupal.org/high-performance If you can't use D7 because it doesn't have the modules you need, then D6 is pretty well supported for large site now, would recommend looking at PressFlow as a distribution - it's coded from the ground up for high performance sites.
TBH your hardware setup will have more of an impact on performance. If you're running your site on some 2-bit shared hosting then it'll be a pig - if you're running on an array of dedicated servers with PressFlow, Varnish caching, dedicated database servers etc, it'll fly.
Well, others have spoke up for Drupal, I have to say I'm a big fan of Joomla.
If you're new to CMS Joomla has much less of a learning curve - and despite statements to the contrary - is just as capable as Drupal for running large/popular sites.
There are quite a few similarities between the two.
For more 'programmy' folks, they seem to really jump into Drupal and like it because it requires a bit more knowledge in that arena to use out of the box. Joomla can be very programmy oriented for the advanced users, or it can be simple to use out of the box (a bit unlike Drupal) for the average user who just wants a nice clean site up quickly.
Both of them have little things that make them unique, but both are completely capable and very similar 'under the hood'. If you do some research between them you'll find in very specific testing - each out performs the other for various specific tasks. If those tasks are important to you, then weigh those tests appropriately.
If you're just a general user looking to make a great site? Joomla has a much more simple/straightforward learning curve and Drupal is more 'programmer' oriented out of the box - but both are good solutions.
I personally choose Joomla - I'm familiar with the framework and can make any sort of custom template/site up and running in short order. Drupal seems to always make me invest more time in customizing modules, having to figure out exactly how to get modules to do what I want them to, etc. Joomla has a huge community (thousands of modules) that typically have a lot of parameters out of the box to get them to work as designed.
Just my $.02! Either way, you won't go wrong if you already have a bit of php knowledge.
That might be a question depending on several factors. Mainly which caching options are offered (usually by 3rd party plugins) Im not much of a fan of Joomla. By your question it sounds like you are new to building a CMS. Have you looked into Wordpress? Very easy to work with and tons of plugins. I would go with that or Drupal.
I realized in the end I didnt really answer your question that well either. To be honest I wouldnt focus on the performance of the CMS you decide to use. There are so many tweaks you can do to apache, IIS, lighttpd, nginx, etc... Also disabling modules and running a lean DB will help out greatly. But since we all like pictures links and quotes here is one that should help http://buytaert.net/drupal-vs-joomla-performance
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Closed 10 years ago.
Alright masterminds. Should I consider joomla or just stick with hardcore coded webdevelopment?
Explanation:
I am basically a programmer with a pretty good command of HTML, Flash, Dreamweaver, Javascript ( though not an expert...yet).
I do not intend to design websites for customers, I do regularly design sites for my own projects.
I have seen some really cool web layouts done with joomla, and wordpress and the like. Now I know that these are content management systems and my projects are ( generally, though not always) not content management systems.
FOR EXAMPLE:
Say I had to design the website for t-mobile, or verizon, or vodafone with their phones and offers and what not, now should I be considering a complete design from scratch or should i pick up a nice looking joomla template and MODIFY it so users can browse for phones, order them , buy on contract ( i actually am working on a smaller version of such a site)
The point being , is it worth spending time modifying a joomla template to your needs or should you just build the whole site from scratch, because after all, "real coders are hard coders??" :)
Any of you out there shedding some light on it would be great help!
Thx
Out of all honesty, I would be more concerned about the functionality rather than design. If you are looking for something along the lines of a e-commerce site then definitely go for Joomla and use a shop extension such as VirtueMart of JoomShopping. With something like this you would need extreme PHP knowledge, therefore can make life very simple by using Joomla and extensions to go with it. Then you can choose a template of your choice of revamp a basic one.
Word of advice though, please oh please don't use flash ;)
Hope this helps.
IT depends on what you need really.
I've been building joomla powered websites for years and I have never modified nor used a ready-made template, but always built them according to the PSD (custom design), and for joomla (unlike wordpress for example) all you need to build custom looking joomla website is HTML / CSS knowledge and hopefully a good framework.
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Closed 10 years ago.
I am making a very specific "control panel" sort of thing to organize information, record statistics, deliver alerts, and things like that.
My initial plan was to make it using CakePHP. I tried Cake, and although I thought it was really awesome, I really hated it due to the fact that it's "automagic." I didn't like how it did all this stuff without me knowing. Yesterday I switched to CodeIgniter, because a friend told me to try it. I like CI much better, however using a PHP framework just doesn't feel right. To me, it doesn't feel nearly free or flexible enough.
My question to you:
Should I continue trying to use a framework, or should I construct a 'semi-framework' that makes certain things easier (layouts, form validation, localization)?
Might I add that I already have a secure authentication system created (well, I THINK it's secure, but that's for a different discussion :P) that would be fairly simple to implement on this site.
Should I continue trying to use a framework, or should I construct a
'semi-framework' that makes certain things easier (layouts, form
validation, localization)?
I think the big issue here is whether using a framework is making your life easier or not. Frameworks are designed to simplify coding by giving you a powerful base to work off of in your own code. If that base is helping you by reducing the amount of code you need to write and the amount of maintenance that goes into it, then yes, I would strongly recommend you use a framework. If the framework is making your job more difficult because it is not well suited to your needs and is not reducing the amount of work you need to do overall, then I would strongly recommend not wasting your time with one.
Just like you'd stop using a dishwasher that isn't helping you wash the dishes faster or better, go ahead and stop using a framework that isn't helping you code faster or better.
It depends on your site. If you have large site with dozens of pages, better use a framework. But if your site is tiny, there is no need in using it.
Try combining Zend with NuSphere PHPEd IDE. Zend is a generic all-purpose framework which allows you to go as hardcore as you desire and it has tons of examples and documentation. PHPEd will enable you to do really nice debugging, even inside the framework code, so that you will feel in absolute control.
On the other hand, reinventing the wheel is never a good idea. You will never be able to get all the form validations right all by yourself and the amount of testing for all this code will make you stay in the office, on Tuesdays, during the graveyard shift :)
It might be a great idea to spend some time reading about some open-source projects, like Magento, so that you can observe the true power of generic frameworks, before trying to write your own.
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Closed 11 years ago.
I am currently looking to get my job portal (www.jobsinajiffy.com) revamped by an outsourced contract. In its new version, it would use LinkedIn and Twitter APIs and would also have microsites for employers with videos and blogposts. I have to decide between Joomla and hand-coding/PHP for the portal development, since competing contractors have suggested these two approaches.
There are several opinions out there regarding what to choose but none of them address a site like this. I am reaching out to you in the hope that you (or somebody you know) can help me make a choice between Joomla and hand-coding with respect to the following parameters:
a)Page load speeds
b)Design customization
c)Stability
d)Ability to handle high traffic
e)Any other points to keep in mind
Well - if I were going the Joomla route for this project I would consider one of the following paths:
a) SOBI Pro - allows you to create multiple directories within one component. Create a directory of positions that people can browse, and a separate directory of potential employees that an agency (or the employers - depending upon how you want it) can search, sort, filter the applicants
b) use an off the shelf employment component - there are a number, but to be honest all the ones I've tried have had limitations in their flexibility. If you find one that is close to what you want you could have it modified.
JomSocial or Community builder could facilitate the subsites areas perhaps - depending upon what you need. Alternatively there are plenty of blogging add-ons available. In fact K2 or one of the other CCK extensions (Zoo, for example) might be capable of being both blog and job directory. Insertion of video is trivial, whether hosted locally, or remotely Amazon S3, YouTube, etc.
The Joomla Extensions Directory JED http://extensions.joomla.org/ is your friend. Start by browsing the top components and think through how they could fit into the bigger picture of your site - either now or down the line.
I'm on record as stating that there are very few online project where you can't get close to what you need with Joomla. I know others who say the same about other Open Source CMSs and I won't argue.
Hand rolling your own solution is possible - but a solution pieced together with off the shelf components is generally massively cheaper - but may not have the same shelf life as hand rolling your own.
In the end you pays your money, you make your choice. One thing I would suggest though - is not 'designing' your complete solution up front. Roll it out in stages. Begin with the bare minimum to make it workable - and add features over time.
Edited to add:
In terms of page load, etc - there is no reason a Joomla site can't be as fast as any other site on the web - as long as it has solid hosting. I may be breaking a community rule here but I'd offer our own site http://www.deanmarshall.co.uk/ as an example. We aim for the front page to load in under 1.5 seconds, with other pages in under 1 second.
You should try PyroCMS, way much easier than joomla and pretty good with the features for a portal.
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Closed 11 years ago.
I want to find an ecommerce solution for my little shop. My friend tells me that Prestashop is very easy to use and develop modules for, but some say Magento is better. Can anybody tell me which is better for developing modules and why?
Having looked under the covers of both of these beasts I can't say that I actually like either of them as they're both rather ugly when you pop the bonnet and something like OpenCart is actually a much nice and easier to work with solution. However, from a feature perspective OpenCart is nowhere near either Magento or PrestaShop and unlike PrestaShop it doesn't have a team of developers behind it. However having said that it is much easier to understand and modify for anyone with a basic knowledge of OO PHP. It is much better structured. PrestaShop is actually a bit ugly under the covers and CSCart (which is an open source, but not free alternative) may also be a viable solution as it only costs like $300 so not that much. I'd have to say I'd personally go for either PrestaShop or CSCart as they do have a lot more features than OpenCart and at the same time also don't cost anywhere near Magento to setup and run. Magento is an absolute nightmare if you're looking to change anything even if you really know what you're doing... Too many layers.
Another cart I would suggest to anyone who isn't fussed about technology is nopCommerce. It's a ASP.NET based shopping cart and it's very well architected and full of features. It is also very easy to modify for anyone with ASP.NET experience.
I fully agree with the opinion that MAGENTO is to "heavy" and consumes too much CPU and memory. If you have your own dedicated server you may try MAGENTO.
But if you can afford shared hosting only use lightweight PRESTASHOP. Much shoppers do not need complicated functionalities provided by MAGENTO and therefore don't like it. More doesn't always mean better - sometimes simpler means better.
Moreover there is large set of PRESTASHOP extensions available free and commercial ones. so every shop owner may choose what he needs and wants. Every potential market gap is filled immediately e.g. if somebody noticed there is no fast checkout option in the guest mode buying. This kind of extension appears immediately on the market.
I haven't used Prestashop but I have recently deployed a Magento store. As others have said, I wouldn't suggest it for small, simple stores. Also, if you are on an economy server, you're likely to have sluggish page loads.
The good news is that (after a steep learning curve), it's incredibly flexible and powerful. I personally think the templating system is great.
Magento is S L O W. It has a very specific list of server requirements that have to be met, and even then it may not work 100%.
Also, using Magento on a shared hosting environment can be VERY insecure as Magento likes to have things writable on the file system. If your hosting company does not have iron clad security another user on that system can make changes in those writeable areas.
As far as code quality, I'd say it's pretty good. It's also more complicated than it needs to be. They completely ignored the K.I.S.S. principle (Keep It Simple, Silly).
To sum up, Magento is good if you are interested in an expensive server and complex development. If you want straight forward, it's not for you.
Magento is more polished, but also a beast to modify, in my experience. After using Magento for a few shops, we switched to Prestashop and are much happier. It took a bit more customization up front (French-based development left some quirks in the address forms, for example), but it is much, much simpler to wrap your brain around and to develop custom modules.
I am not a programmer, so I am confined to noob-like needs. At first I tried Magento, and found it to be difficult. It also "crashed" (not sure what word to use) a couple times, the last time beyond something I could figure out. I began to wonder if the entire thing was created just to get me to get in so deep that I'd need pro support to fix it when in a pinch.
So as I searched the internet looking for a decent alternative, I stumbled upon PrestaShop. I gave it a shot, since my Magento site was still RIP. Found it to be much easier to use, and I had a shop up and running (STILL up and running) in a day.
So I'm not sure what it all means, but hands down I liked PrestaShop better. I did like the options to create multiple shopping experiences within Magento, but I figure I can just use multiple PrestaShop installs to accomplish the same thing. Either way I'd have to customize 'em, anyway.
So that's my two cents, for what it's worth. Hope it helps someone.
Magento is a very complex solution for large shops that require good hardware base to handle more than 500 products. Although even though there is a lot of resources to start with Magento.
I have personally found out that building themes is really easy once you find your way around few annoying things like XML layout dependencies (there is barely anything documented on XML, which is the base for making good themes for Magento) and objects in PHP (some functions and data is not accessible from certain parts of the template just because).
I'm very comfortable with working and writing my own apps in OO PHP but stuff that Magento pulls off sometimes is really annoying and also directory structure and the way themes are being handled is awkward...
On the other hand, PrestaShop is fast (after few tweaks), but still requires some work in the back-end. I am developing a lot of back-end modules to help people get the most out of this system as it's worth it. Plus the community is growing and developers are fixing everything they can.
One more thing: writing both, back-end and front-end modules for Prestashop is incredibly easy, plus using SMARTY for templates is a good choice.
Edit: Magento is very easy to break during or after deployment (especially between localhost and a hosted space) and maintenance in SVN might be a pain for inexperienced devs.
I tried both, first I use magento, which is powerful but also very require a good php setting for the server.
prestashop is more easy to use, if you are small store you may choose prestashop.
Magento is a very complete solution in order to have a big shop, with more than 500 products.
But, for newbies, it's very difficult to load and modify it.
Today, I have a website on magento with more than 20,000 products, and we still have issues.
It very difficult to configure it, and without a nice optimization, you will have very slowly website.
I advise you less than 300 products to use prestashop.
Like you, i am NOT a programmer but a store owner. So i hope my view point helps you, i have used both PrestaShop and Magento.
Magento i didn't like, boat ware!
Prestashop is good, pretty templates but the good modules are not free and to get an online shop with the features you need can end up costing 1000s
I also use Zen Cart, while it has the worlds ugliest standard template, if your CSS knowledge is average you can make it look pretty much like anything you want. It has more features built in than the Magento £11k pa has and all modules on the site are free and also a better community too as the forums are open source focused.
Hope it helps.
PrestaShop is your best bet. The only problem with PrestaShop is that uses smarty template engine and rather than write clean PHP without the need of loops etc, in smarty they have made it a very great deal of effort for the average person to theme.
I will stand behind PrestaShop 100 percent if they get rid of smarty and implement a simpler templating system such as a main html file with includes that you can just embed PHP template tags into.
If it is for a 'little' shop don't bother using magento.
It's now getting to the point that PrestaShop has a lot more features than the free version of Magento, so I would if you want to spend thousands a year to get the best, get Magento. If you want a great community which releases all sorts of modules and themes for free (along with a bunch of great paid ones), PrestaShop is the way to go.
One big thing that I want to do is give people vouchers/coupons, so if I meet them or sell them something, they can use the coupon on another purchase. It's built into PrestaShop, but with Magento you need to give them a lot of money in order to use that feature. Albeit you get a lot of features for a lot of money, but for a lot of small businesses, it is a lot cheaper to use PrestaShop and pay professionals to work on it and pay for some modules than shell out a lot of money every single year to Magento.
Oh yeah, when you pay for Magento, you are only getting a one-year license. I was really into Magento until I found this out, now I don't give a damn about the company or it's faux open-source project that they have swept underneath the carpet.
I used Prestashop, it is really good one. As an programmer can customize and make required changes in it. Also Prestashop having good modules which are available for free.
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Closed 11 years ago.
How has the current economic downturn affected the way you/your team works ?
I am tending to do more enhancements, compared to brand new development a year or so ago.
This question came about during another pub conversation where we were discussing if it's good to work on supporting applications or working on new projects - which is more stable, for the foreseeable future, with companies cost cutting in all areas..
I mainly work on extending existing applications. I would say this is probably the safer of the two options also. More than likely people are already using the existing applications, and because of that you don't need to convince them it would be advantageous for them to start using it. From a business perspective, it is a lot easier to justify an expense than you already have than to try and add an additional one.
Number 3: rewriting existing apps (the guy who used to do my job suuuuccccckkkked).
Definitely seeing a downturn in large scale or new projects in general though, which is kind of the programming equivalent of saving not spending. Actually it's the literal equivalent of that, which is a problem for getting out of a recession.
Good question. I am at present working with project that has good customers and a decent revenue. So, the economic downturn did not affect much.
My suggestion is if there is a choice between choosing enhancing the existing projects or new projects, its better to go for the revenue generating existing projects. And investment in R&D projects may be reduced.
I believe "supporting" and bug-fixing on existing projects would not bring your much challenge and consequently experience. It can be a huge time waste for the career.
I am working on porting an existing business application to a new platform, which combines some of the aspects of work on an existing app, and some new stuff.
Its new because everything is going from Windows Forms to ASP.NET AJAX, and there are several changes involved in that process when it comes to the GUI and event based side of things, but its also partially work with existing stuff because the business rules are the same, the database is the same, although we have been gradually making improvements as needed to those.
On the other hand the company I work for supplies grocery stores which have been affected positively by more people eating at home, so despite being in Michigan, things are going well for the company, and we can afford to move this app onto the intranet.
The nice part about doing this is I get to learn all the new platform stuff, but we don't have to go out and get user input for some new set of use cases, plus we can work with the input we've received from the WinForms version.
I'm rewriting our existing applications. The fundamental design of the original applications wasn't flexible enough to handle our new business needs. Combined with questionable coding practices (a lack of separation of model, view and control and aging technologies with a lot of "NIH" syndrome) it was decided that rewriting the non-central portions of our applications was best.
Sadly, I'm not entirely sure I'm 100% qualified for this, but, I seem to be the most qualified of our team.
90% of my job is maintenance, or seems to be. But surprisingly, I've got about four projects of new development going or in the pipeline.