I'm just trying to figure out how these two things work. Obviously websocket's use push technology, so the client doesn't have to do long polling, or constantly refresh and check if something has changed (Kind of like an event listener).
But with delegation, like in objective C, are delegates constantly checking, by sending requests over and over again, to see if a method has been fired. Or is the information that a method has been fired PUSHed over to the delegates?
Or my third theory about delegates is, since they are of course in the same program, do the two classes (protocol and delegate class) always have an "open connection", kind of like Polling. Or is it like my second paragraph, where the information is truly being PUSHed.
WebSockets are a bi-directional full-duplex message based communication channel. Many push technologies can get low server to client (browser) latency, but with WebSockets you also get low client to server latency (and therefore low round-trip latency).
From my reading (I'm not an Objective-C expert), delegates are a just a way of creating a loose protocol (in the object sense, not in the network sense) between objects. I don't know the implementation details but I'm certain that there is no polling going on. The delegate methods are probably just looked up when needed. There is no need for an "open connection" or polling. Think of delegates as a way of doing function/method calls, not as a network transport (like WebSockets). This Apple doc goes into deeper detail.
Related
I read a lot of questions around the same use case but couldn't find any proper answer on Google.
One theory is the Server keep a long poll at sender (A) and whenever a typing event is triggered it sends update to server.
On the receiver's end (B), it keep another long polling request to the server and as soon as the server get's update from sender(A) it sends it to the receiver (B).
But this seems dubious, in the sense that servers have to handle so many (~millions) of long polling requests at any given time and will slow down the servers.
Most chat systems probably keep open P2P TCP connections with their clients.
This solves many issues in chat systems such as avoiding polling on multiple scenarios, not only the ones you mentioned but receiving new messages as well.
I recommend checking out this video
In this type of design "Someone is typing" becomes just one new type of event, it has a SRC and a DST and the Backend infrastructure takes care of routing the event to the correct websocket for the DST client.
I imagine as others mentioned that the clients will throttle the events as to avoid network traffic on every key press.
After using several different messaging and RPC systems I have come to the conclusion that you eventually always need traditional RPC, and push events of some kind. Otherwise you inevitably end up with some polling hack.
For example, HTTP originally only supported RPC-style methods (GET and POST return a response immediately). People realised that push events were needed so hacked it using long polling. Eventually this was fixed with Server-Sent Events.
CoAP (a lightweight UDP-based version of HTTP) also supports push events by adding a 'monitor' option to GET requests. It's a pretty elegant solution.
But neither of those are Thrift-style RPC, by which I mean you write an interface definition file, and there is some tool that compiles that interface into native code for your language of choice. Thereafter you can just call remote procedures almost as if they are local ones.
So my question is, are there any Thrift-style RPC systems that let you subscribe to push events and call a callback (or similar) when an event arrives?
Yes:
gRPC supports "streaming", which means a single logical RPC call can actually involve multiple messages in each direction.
Cap'n Proto supports object capabilities, which allows either side of the connection to send an object reference to the other side, to which calls can be made. For example, the client could call a method on the server and, as one of the method parameters, provide a callback object. The callback object implements some pre-defined RPC interface. When the server calls the callback object, it is making a call back to the client. In fact, Cap'n Proto connections are fully symmetric: there is no distinction at the protocol level between client and server.
(Disclosure: I am the author of Cap'n Proto, and was also the author of Protocol Buffers v2, though I am not affiliated with gRPC.)
I have a question.
Facebook probably uses ajax to notify user about a new message, is this correct?
If yes, would not this tax db to incredible levels?
I mean millions of users every second of being online requesting message status.
Or am I thinking about this in a wrong way?
You are asking about a technique called polling. And you are correct that it has scalability issues. In general not a good idea.
[rant]I have no idea what facebook does. I hate facebook. It's like a drunk whore who won't stop texting/emailing you and needs to be used.[/rant].
There are better alternatives to polling. One technique is called long polling, and then there is server side push.
See
How do I implement basic "Long Polling"?
and
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/6883540/http-server-to-client-push-technologies-standards-libraries.
In long polling, the client sends a request but does not expect a response immediately; the response could come immediately, in a second, or in an hour. The challenge is for the server to manage the outstanding requests in a non-resource intensive way.
With server side push, the server maintains a connection with clients and can broadcast messages to its connections when events occur.
Which alternative to use depends a bit on your technology stack. For example, node.js has something called socket.io (which I think is server side push using html5 websockets) which I hear good things about.
Similar questions have been asked before and they all reached the conclusion that AJAX will not become obsolete. But in what ways is ajax better than websockets?
With socket.io, it's easy to fall back to flash or long polling, so browser compatibility seems to be a non-issue.
Websockets are bidirectional. Where ajax would make an asynchronous request, websocket client would send a message to the server. The POST/GET parameters can be encoded in JSON.
So what is wrong with using 100% websockets? If every visitor maintains a persistent websocket connection to the server, would that be more wasteful than making a few ajax requests throughout the visit session?
I think it would be more wasteful. For every connected client you need some sort of object/function/code/whatever on the server paired up with that one client. A socket handler, or a file descriptor, or however your server is setup to handle the connections.
With AJAX you don't need a 1:1 mapping of server side resource to client. Your # of clients can scale less dependently than your server-side resources. Even node.js has its limitations to how many connections it can handle and keep open.
The other thing to consider is that certain AJAX responses can be cached too. As you scale up you can add an HTTP cache to help reduce the load from frequent AJAX requests.
Short Answer
Keeping a websocket active has a cost, for both the client and the server, whether Ajax will have a cost only once, depending on what you're doing with it.
Long Answer
Websockets are often misunderstood because of this whole "Hey, use Ajax, that will do !". No, Websockets are not a replacement for Ajax. They can potentially be applied to the same fields, but there are cases where using Websocket is absurd.
Let's take a simple example : A dynamic page which loads data after the page is loaded on the client side. It's simple, make an Ajax call. We only need one direction, from the server to the client. The client will ask for these data, the server will send them to the client, done. Why would you implement websockets for such a task ? You don't need your connection to be opened all the time, you don't need the client to constantly ask the server, you don't need the server to notify the client. The connection will stay open, it will waste resources, because to keep a connection open you need to constantly check it.
Now for a chat application things are totally different. You need your client to be notified by the server instead of forcing the client to ask the server every x seconds or milliseconds if something is new. It would make no sense.
To understand better, see that as two persons. One of the two is the server, the over is the client. Ajax is like sending a letter. The client sends a letter, the server responds with another letter. The fact is that, for a chat application the conversation would be like that :
"Hey Server, got something for me ?
- No.
- Hey Server, got something for me ?
- No.
- Hey Server, got something for me ?
- Yes, here it is."
The server can't actually send a letter to the client, if the client never asked for an answer. It's a huge waste of resources. Because for every Ajax request, even if it's cached, you need to make an operation on the server side.
Now the case I discussed earlier with the data loaded with Ajax. Imagine the client is on the phone with the server. Keeping the connection active has a cost. It costs electricity and you have to pay your operator. Now why would you need to call someone and keep him on phone for an hour, if you just want that person to tell you 3 words ? Send a goddamn letter.
In conclusion Websockets are not a total replacement for Ajax !
Sometimes you will need Ajax where Websocket usage is absurd.
Edit : The SSE case
That technology isn't used very widely but it can be useful. As its name states it, Server-Sent Events are a one-way push from the server to the client. The client doesn't request anything, the server just sends the data.
In short :
- Unidirectional from the client : Ajax
- Unidirectional from the server : SSE
- Bidirectional : Websockets
Personally, I think that websockets will be used more and more in web applications instead of AJAX. They are not well suited to web sites where caching and SEO are of greater concern, but they will do wonders for webapps.
Projects such as DNode and socketstream help to remove the complexity and enable simple RPC-style coding. This means your client code just calls a function on the server, passing whatever data to that function it wants. And the server can call a function on the client and pass it data as well. You don't need to concern yourself with the nitty gritties of TCP.
Furthermore, there is a lot of overhead with AJAX calls. For instance, a connection needs to be established and HTTP headers (cookies, etc.) are passed with every request. Websockets eliminate much of that. Some say that websockets are more wasteful, and perhaps they are right. But I'm not convinced that the difference is really that substantial.
I answered another related question in detail, including many links to related resources. You might check it out:
websocket api to replace rest api?
I think that sooner or later websocket based frameworks will start to popup not just for writing real-time chat like parts of web apps, but also as standalone web frameworks. Once permanent connection is created it can be used for receiving all kinds of stuff including UI parts of web application which are now served for example through AJAX requests. This approach may hurt SEO in some way although it can reduce amount of traffic and load generated by asynchronous requests which includes redundant HTTP headers.
However I doubt that websockets will replace or endanger AJAX because there are numerous scenarios where permanent connections are unnecessary or unwanted. For example mashup applications which are using (one time) single purpose REST based services that doesn't need to be permanently connected with clients.
There's nothing "wrong" about it.
The only difference is mostly readability. The main advantage of Ajax is that it allows you fast development because most of the functionality is written for you.
There's a great advantage in not having to re-invent the wheel every time you want to open a socket.
WS:// connections have far less overhead than "AJAX" requests.
As other people said, keeping the connection open can be overkill in some scenarios where you don't need server to client notifications, or client to server request happens with low frecuency.
But another disadvantage is that websockets is a low level protocol, not offering additional features to TCP once the initial handshake is performed. So when implementing a request-response paradigm over websockets, you will probably miss features that HTTP (a very mature and extense protocol family) offers, like caching (client and shared caches), validation (conditional requests), safety and idempotence (with implications on how the agent behaves), range requests, content types, status codes, ...
That is, you reduce message sizes at a cost.
So my choice is AJAX for request-response, websockets for server pushing and high frequency low latency messaging
If you want the connection to server open and if continuous polling to the server will be there then go for sockets else you are good to go with ajax.
Simple Analogy :
Ajax asks questions(requests) to server and server gives answers(responses) to these questions. Now if you want to ask continuous questions then ajax wont work, it has a large overhead which will require resources at both the ends.
Will web sockets when used in all web browsers make ajax obsolete?
Cause if I could use web sockets to fetch data and update data in realtime, why would I need ajax? Even if I use ajax to just fetch data once when the application started I still might want to see if this data has changed after a while.
And will web sockets be possible in cross-domains or only to the same origin?
WebSockets will not make AJAX entirely obsolete and WebSockets can do cross-domain.
AJAX
AJAX mechanisms can be used with plain web servers. At its most basic level, AJAX is just a way for a web page to make an HTTP request. WebSockets is a much lower level protocol and requires a WebSockets server (either built into the webserver, standalone, or proxied from the webserver to a standalone server).
With WebSockets, the framing and payload is determined by the application. You could send HTML/XML/JSON back and forth between client and server, but you aren't forced to. AJAX is HTTP. WebSockets has a HTTP friendly handshake, but WebSockets is not HTTP. WebSockets is a bi-directional protocol that is closer to raw sockets (intentionally so) than it is to HTTP. The WebSockets payload data is UTF-8 encoded in the current version of the standard but this is likely to be changed/extended in future versions.
So there will probably always be a place for AJAX type requests even in a world where all clients support WebSockets natively. WebSockets is trying to solve situations where AJAX is not capable or marginally capable (because WebSockets its bi-directional and much lower overhead). But WebSockets does not replace everything AJAX is used for.
Cross-Domain
Yes, WebSockets supports cross-domain. The initial handshake to setup the connection communicates origin policy information. The wikipedia page shows an example of a typical handshake: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebSockets
I'll try to break this down into questions:
Will web sockets when used in all web browsers make ajax obsolete?
Absolutely not. WebSockets are raw socket connections to the server. This comes with it's own security concerns. AJAX calls are simply async. HTTP requests that can follow the same validation procedures as the rest of the pages.
Cause if I could use web sockets to fetch data and update data in realtime, why would I need ajax?
You would use AJAX for simpler more manageable tasks. Not everyone wants to have the overhead of securing a socket connection to simply allow async requests. That can be handled simply enough.
Even if I use ajax to just fetch data once when the application started I still might want to see if this data has changed after a while.
Sure, if that data is changing. You may not have the data changing or constantly refreshing. Again, this is code overhead that you have to account for.
And will web sockets be possible in cross-domains or only to the same origin?
You can have cross domain WebSockets but you have to code your WS server to accept them. You have access to the domain (host) header which you can then use to accept / deny requests. This can, however, be spoofed by something as simple as nc. In order to truly secure the connection you will need to authenticate the connection by other means.
Websockets have a couple of big downsides in terms of scalability that ajax avoids. Since ajax sends a request/response and closes the connection (..or shortly after) if someone stays on the web page it doesn't use server resources when idling. Websockets are meant to stream data back to the browser, and they tie up server resources to do so. Servers have a limit in how many simultaneous connections they can keep open at one time. Not to mention depending on your server side technology, they may tie up a thread to handle the socket. So websockets have more resource intensive requirements for both sides per connection. You could easily exhaust all of your threads servicing clients and then no new clients could come in if lots of users are just sitting on the page. This is where nodejs, vertx, netty can really help out, but even those have upper limits as well.
Also there is the issue of state of the underlying socket, and writing the code on both sides that carry on the stateful conversation which isn't something you have to do with ajax style because it's stateless. Websockets require you create a low level protocol which is solved for you with ajax. Things like heart beating, closing idle connections, reconnection on errors, etc are vitally important now. These are things you didn't have to solve when using AJAX because it was stateless. State is very important to the stability of your app and more importantly the health of your server. It's not trivial. Pre-HTTP we built a lot of stateful TCP protocols (FTP, telnet, SSH), and then HTTP happened. And no one did that stuff much anymore because even with its limitations HTTP was surprisingly easier and more robust. Websockets bring back the good and the bad of stateful protocols. You'll learn soon enough if you didn't get a dose of that last go around.
If you need streaming of realtime data this extra overhead is warranted because polling the server to get streamed data is worse, but if all you are doing is user interaction->request->response->update UI, then ajax is easier and will use less resources because once the response is sent the conversation is over and no additional server resources are used. So I think it's a tradeoff and the architect has to decide which tool fits their problem. AJAX has its place, and websockets have their place.
Update
So the architecture of your server is what matters when we are talking about threads. If you are using a traditionally multi-threaded server (or processes) where a each socket connection gets its own thread to respond to requests then websockets matter a lot to you. So for each connection we have a socket, and eventually the OS will fall over if you have too many of these, and the same goes for threads (more so for processes). Threads are heavier than sockets (in terms of resources) so we try and conserve how many threads we have running simultaneously. That means creating a thread pool which is just a fixed number of threads that is shared among all sockets. But once a socket is opened the thread is used for the entire conversation. The length of those conversations govern how quickly you can repurpose those threads for new sockets coming in. The length of your conversation governs how much you can scale. However if you are streaming this model doesn't work well for scaling. You have to break the thread/socket design.
HTTP's request/response model makes it very efficient in turning over threads for new sockets. If you are just going to use request/response use HTTP its already built and much easier than reimplementing something like that in websockets.
Since websockets don't have to be request/response as HTTP and can stream data if your server has a fixed number of threads in its thread pool and you have the same number of websockets tying up all of your threads with active conversations, you can't service new clients coming in! You've reached your maximum capacity. That's where protocol design is important too with websockets and threads. Your protocol might allow you to loosen the thread per socket per conversation model that way people just sitting there don't use a thread on your server.
That's where asynchronous single thread servers come in. In Java we often call this NIO for non-blocking IO. That means it's a different API for sockets where sending and receiving data doesn't block the thread performing the call.
So traditional in blocking sockets when you call socket.read() or socket.write() they wait until the data is received or sent before returning control to your program. That means your program is stuck waiting for the socket data to come in or go out until you can do anything else. That's why we have threads so we can do work concurrently (at the same time). Send this data to client X while I wait on data from client Y. Concurrencies is the name of the game when we talk about servers.
In a NIO server we use a single thread to handle all clients and register callbacks to be notified when data arrives. For example
socket.read( function( data ) {
// data is here! Now you can process it very quickly without waiting!
});
The socket.read() call will return immediately without reading any data, but our function we provided will be called when it comes in. This design radically changes how you build and architect your code because if you get hung up waiting on something you can't receive any new clients. You have a single thread you can't really do two things at once! You have to keep that one thread moving.
NIO, Asynchronous IO, Event based program as this is all known as, is a much more complicated system design, and I wouldn't suggest you try and write this if you are starting out. Even very Senior programmers find it very hard to build a robust systems. Since you are asynchronous you can't call APIs that block. Like reading data from the DB or sending messages to other servers have to be performed asynchronously. Even reading/writing from the file system can slow your single thread down lowering your scalability. Once you go asynchronous it's all asynchronous all the time if you want to keep the single thread moving. That's where it gets challenging because eventually you'll run into an API, like DBs, that is not asynchronous and you have to adopt more threads at some level. So a hybrid approaches are common even in the asynchronous world.
The good news is there are other solutions that use this lower level API already built that you can use. NodeJS, Vertx, Netty, Apache Mina, Play Framework, Twisted Python, Stackless Python, etc. There might be some obscure library for C++, but honestly I wouldn't bother. Server technology doesn't require the very fastest languages because it's IO bound more than CPU bound. If you are a die hard performance nut use Java. It has a huge community of code to pull from and it's speed is very close (and sometimes better) than C++. If you just hate it go with Node or Python.
Yes, yes it does. :D
The earlier answers lack imagination. I see no more reason to use AJAX if websockets are available to you.